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Hello, I have been trying to find out what the hardware requirements are for Chimera. For example, how can it be run in a cluster environment with CUDA cards, but no Nvidia graphics cards? My search for information has been hampered by an apparent failure or reorganization of the main site -https://www.cgl.ucsf.edu/chimera/ Every internal link from that page (like to Downloads) is broken. Will the broken links be fixed? Is another page the preferred one for Chimera? Do I need the OSMesa version to run without graphics cards? Thanks, Calvin Dodge Calvin Dodge Systems Analyst Office: 832-271-7148 Email : cdodge@x-iss.com<mailto:ellorente@x-iss.com> http://www.x-iss.com<https://mail.x-iss.com/owa/redir.aspx?C=32dc65a1e7df4e4289ad76e23a15fcf0&URL=http%3a%2f%2fwww.x-iss.com%2f> [cid:image001.png@01D5DB72.2E9C2F40]<http://www.x-iss.com/> Smart Management and Analytics for Clusters
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(We're working on the web site issues.) So the real question is why do you want to run Chimera in a cluster environment? Chimera is not designed to run in a cluster environment, it is designed to run a user's desktop computer using 3D graphics. Chimera does not use CUDA. That said, there is a headless version for Linux that uses a software implementation of OpenGL to create images that you could use in a cluster, so no graphics card is needed. ChimeraX, our successor to Chimera, can take advantage of CUDA in some circumstances, but it is not required. ChimeraX also only works headless on Linux, with a software implementation of OpenGL. The headless operation is included in every Linux version. So no graphics card is needed there either. We are investigating ways to take advantage of the graphic card's performance when running headless, but we're not there yet. HTH, Greg On 10/21/2020 9:24 AM, Calvin Dodge wrote:
Hello,
I have been trying to find out what the hardware requirements are for Chimera. For example, how can it be run in a cluster environment with CUDA cards, but no Nvidia graphics cards?
My search for information has been hampered by an apparent failure or reorganization of the main site -https://www.cgl.ucsf.edu/chimera/
Every internal link from that page (like to Downloads) is broken.
Will the broken links be fixed? Is another page the preferred one for Chimera? Do I need the OSMesa version to run without graphics cards?
Thanks,
Calvin Dodge
*/Calvin Dodge/*/ Systems Analyst/
/Office: 832-271-7148/
/ /Email : cdodge@x-iss.com <mailto:ellorente@x-iss.com>
http://www.x-iss.com <https://mail.x-iss.com/owa/redir.aspx?C=32dc65a1e7df4e4289ad76e23a15fcf0&URL=http%3a%2f%2fwww.x-iss.com%2f>
Smart Management and Analytics for Clusters
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Hi Calvin, Ideally Chimera should be run on directly on the Mac, Windows or Linux computer a person is using, not on a server. The program is primarily for highly interactive data analysis and remote display causes latency that makes it a poor experience. Even a few tenths of second lag makes it burdensome to rotate models to desired view points, etc.... Chimera and ChimeraX use OpenGL graphics. OpenGL only works with a window. So unless you have windowing system running it will not render images. Virtual window systems on a server often don't support OpenGL well or at all even with a graphics card. I don't know if CUDA cards do OpenGL rendering, but if so that is even less likely to work with a virtual window system. It has been one or two decades since remote display with X windows of OpenGL worked reliably. Occasionally it can still work if the server and client have exactly the same graphics drivers. The headless Chimera on Linux is for using Chimera for server applications where the graphical user interface is not used at all. That will only use OSMesa, all software rendering (again since OpenGL is not designed to work without a window). Sorry our web site is down temporarily this morning due to unexpected server update issues. Tom
On Oct 21, 2020, at 9:24 AM, Calvin Dodge <cdodge@x-iss.com> wrote:
Hello,
I have been trying to find out what the hardware requirements are for Chimera. For example, how can it be run in a cluster environment with CUDA cards, but no Nvidia graphics cards?
My search for information has been hampered by an apparent failure or reorganization of the main site -https://www.cgl.ucsf.edu/chimera/ <https://www.cgl.ucsf.edu/chimera/> Every internal link from that page (like to Downloads) is broken.
Will the broken links be fixed? Is another page the preferred one for Chimera? Do I need the OSMesa version to run without graphics cards?
Thanks,
Calvin Dodge
Calvin Dodge Systems Analyst Office: 832-271-7148
Email : cdodge@x-iss.com <mailto:ellorente@x-iss.com> http://www.x-iss.com <https://mail.x-iss.com/owa/redir.aspx?C=32dc65a1e7df4e4289ad76e23a15fcf0&URL=http%3a%2f%2fwww.x-iss.com%2f> <37143B47803B42398F4BF8870B0FECB0[25452176].png> <http://www.x-iss.com/> Smart Management and Analytics for Clusters
_______________________________________________ Chimera-users mailing list: Chimera-users@cgl.ucsf.edu <mailto:Chimera-users@cgl.ucsf.edu> Manage subscription: https://plato.cgl.ucsf.edu/mailman/listinfo/chimera-users <https://plato.cgl.ucsf.edu/mailman/listinfo/chimera-users>
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Hi Calvin, Our web sites are back up now. For running Chimera on a server, it depends what you will be doing with Chimera. If you will be running Chimera-command or Python scripts that don't save images, you can use any version with the --nogui flag. If you will be running scripts that do save images, you can only do that with the "headless" Linux version. If users will be trying to run Chimera from the server and remoting their display to their client, that will be very difficult to get to work (assuming the remoting is via the X protocol). It rarely works unless both the client and the server have the same graphics card, and since your server has no graphics card... --Eric Eric Pettersen UCSF Computer Graphics Lab
On Oct 21, 2020, at 9:24 AM, Calvin Dodge <cdodge@x-iss.com> wrote:
Hello,
I have been trying to find out what the hardware requirements are for Chimera. For example, how can it be run in a cluster environment with CUDA cards, but no Nvidia graphics cards?
My search for information has been hampered by an apparent failure or reorganization of the main site -https://www.cgl.ucsf.edu/chimera/ <https://www.cgl.ucsf.edu/chimera/> Every internal link from that page (like to Downloads) is broken.
Will the broken links be fixed? Is another page the preferred one for Chimera? Do I need the OSMesa version to run without graphics cards?
Thanks,
Calvin Dodge
Calvin Dodge Systems Analyst Office: 832-271-7148
Email : cdodge@x-iss.com <mailto:ellorente@x-iss.com> http://www.x-iss.com <https://mail.x-iss.com/owa/redir.aspx?C=32dc65a1e7df4e4289ad76e23a15fcf0&URL=http%3a%2f%2fwww.x-iss.com%2f> <37143B47803B42398F4BF8870B0FECB0[25452176].png> <http://www.x-iss.com/> Smart Management and Analytics for Clusters
_______________________________________________ Chimera-users mailing list: Chimera-users@cgl.ucsf.edu <mailto:Chimera-users@cgl.ucsf.edu> Manage subscription: https://plato.cgl.ucsf.edu/mailman/listinfo/chimera-users <https://plato.cgl.ucsf.edu/mailman/listinfo/chimera-users>
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My coworkers are overly pessimistic about remotely displaying Chimera. My previous suggestion of using VirtualGL works remarkably well if the remote computer is Linux and the network is fast (e.g., at work, and not at home). Depending on how Chimera is used, it might be acceptable for use from home too. Just don't expect it to be respond quickly. VirtualGL is a OpenGL wrapper that uses the graphics card on the remote computer and sends an image of the graphics window to the local user. That way you get to use the Chimera's GUI interface. So in this case, you do need a graphics card and the corresponding graphics driver (AMD or NVIDIA recommended). VirtualGL is available at virtualgl.org. -- Greg On 10/21/2020 2:45 PM, Eric Pettersen wrote:
Hi Calvin, Our web sites are back up now. For running Chimera on a server, it depends what you will be doing with Chimera. If you will be running Chimera-command or Python scripts that don't save images, you can use any version with the --nogui flag. If you will be running scripts that do save images, you can only do that with the "headless" Linux version. If users will be trying to run Chimera from the server and remoting their display to their client, that will be very difficult to get to work (assuming the remoting is via the X protocol). It rarely works unless both the client and the server have the same graphics card, and since your server has no graphics card...
--Eric
Eric Pettersen UCSF Computer Graphics Lab
On Oct 21, 2020, at 9:24 AM, Calvin Dodge <cdodge@x-iss.com <mailto:cdodge@x-iss.com>> wrote:
Hello, I have been trying to find out what the hardware requirements are for Chimera. For example, how can it be run in a cluster environment with CUDA cards, but no Nvidia graphics cards? My search for information has been hampered by an apparent failure or reorganization of the main site -https://www.cgl.ucsf.edu/chimera/ Every internal link from that page (like to Downloads) is broken. Will the broken links be fixed? Is another page the preferred one for Chimera? Do I need the OSMesa version to run without graphics cards? Thanks, Calvin Dodge */Calvin Dodge/*/ Systems Analyst/ /Office: 832-271-7148/ / /Email :cdodge@x-iss.com <mailto:ellorente@x-iss.com> http://www.x-iss.com <https://mail.x-iss.com/owa/redir.aspx?C=32dc65a1e7df4e4289ad76e23a15fcf0&URL=http%3a%2f%2fwww.x-iss.com%2f> <37143B47803B42398F4BF8870B0FECB0[25452176].png> <http://www.x-iss.com/> Smart Management and Analytics for Clusters _______________________________________________ Chimera-users mailing list:Chimera-users@cgl.ucsf.edu <mailto:Chimera-users@cgl.ucsf.edu> Manage subscription:https://plato.cgl.ucsf.edu/mailman/listinfo/chimera-users
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participants (4)
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Calvin Dodge
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Eric Pettersen
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Greg Couch
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Tom Goddard