I am writing an article promoting the use of VR for modelling. I use an HTC Vive to access ChimeraX VR, but I have heard rumours it will be discontinued soon. The Samsung Odyssey is already discontinued. With Meta dominating the VR headset market, many companies are bailing out. Do you have any recommendations about which headsets should scientists invest in if they want to use ChimeraX?
Thank you!
-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. . ||**|||** /|||**|||** /|||**|||** /|||**|||** /|||**|||** /|||**|||** /| |/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|| ~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `-~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `-
*Jessie MNG Lopez Suzuki*
PhD Candidate, Molecular, Cell and Developmental Biology *Zahler Laboratory* The Center for Molecular Biology of RNA University of California, Santa Cruz Sinsheimer 419 (831) 459-5127 *jlopez99@ucsc.edu jlopez99@ucsc.edu* (they, she or he pronouns)
Hi Jessie,
ChimeraX VR works with all the PC VR headsets including the Oculus Quest 2 and the Valve Index. It uses SteamVR for the PC to talk to the headset and as long as SteamVR continues to support a headset it will keep working with ChimeraX. I have not heard anything about support for HTC Vive being dropped. That is an old headset and it has not been made for a few years now I think, but it still works fine. Could you tell me your source about support being discontinued? Maybe future SteamVR could require firmware updates to the headset and HTC will not produce those, and that could kill the headset. But I think that would make HTC Vive users very mad so I doubt HTC will kill their old Vive headset.
Here is advise for VR. I have used Quest 2 with a cable to the PC (Oculus Link), works perfectly. I've used the Quest 2 with their beta AirLink which connects to the PC by wifi with no cable, worked perfectly. My Quest 2 is the lower memory model (128 GB) because I don't put a lot of games on the headset so it cost only $300. I paid another $100 for a Kiwi headstrap that and face pad that is more comfortable, and for the link cable. This is very cheap and the best bargain.
I also have a Valve Index with their famous Index controllers and base stations, cost is $1000. There are some technical differences with the Quest 2 that may make you prefer it or may make you prefer Quest 2.
Both Quest 2 and Valve Index feel pretty horrible on my face -- which is surprising because I have many older headsets (Oculus Rift, Oculus Rift S, HTC Vive, HTC Vive Pro, Samsung Odyssey) that all feel pretty good. The Quest 2 is very heavy because it contains a battery since it is mostly intended to use standalone without a PC. (ChimeraX cannot run standalone on Quest 2 because it does not support the Android operating system). So comfort-wise I like most our Vive Pro headsets ($1200 or $1400 for Vive Pro 2) and use those most often.
Besides the headset the graphics card is an important and expensive item for using PC VR. Graphics cards are super expensive right now due to supply chain issues. A top of the line RTX 3090 has suggested price of $1500 but you might have to pay $3000 to get it. That is the top end. A $400 graphics card will work well for most data. But a 5 year old graphics card (e.g. GTX 1060) might struggle some with a new higher pixel resolution headset (e.g. Quest 2 or Valve Index or Vive Pro 2), while it might be fine for your lower resolution HTC Vive headset which is almost 7 years old now (released March 2015).
Tom
On Feb 16, 2022, at 11:32 AM, Jessie Lopez via ChimeraX-users chimerax-users@cgl.ucsf.edu wrote:
I am writing an article promoting the use of VR for modelling. I use an HTC Vive to access ChimeraX VR, but I have heard rumours it will be discontinued soon. The Samsung Odyssey is already discontinued. With Meta dominating the VR headset market, many companies are bailing out. Do you have any recommendations about which headsets should scientists invest in if they want to use ChimeraX?
Thank you!
-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. . |||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /| |/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||| ~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `-~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `- Jessie MNG Lopez Suzuki
PhD Candidate, Molecular, Cell and Developmental Biology Zahler Laboratory The Center for Molecular Biology of RNA University of California, Santa Cruz Sinsheimer 419 (831) 459-5127 jlopez99@ucsc.edu mailto:jlopez99@ucsc.edu (they, she or he pronouns)
ChimeraX-users mailing list ChimeraX-users@cgl.ucsf.edu Manage subscription: https://www.rbvi.ucsf.edu/mailman/listinfo/chimerax-users
Thank you so much Tom! This is excellent information and will help me write my article. Thank you for your prompt and thorough reply and for your continued work on ChimeraX and VR development. I think it's so important!
The major claim in the discussion section of my recently published paper (Suzuki et al., PLoSGenetics, 2022 https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pgen.1010028) is a direct result of me viewing a spliceosome structure in virtual reality on ChimeraX. Even the lab that obtained the structure didn't notice how well positioned KIN17 is to act as a regulator of splicing cycle progression.
Thank you.
Jessie
-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. . ||**|||** /|||**|||** /|||**|||** /|||**|||** /|||**|||** /|||**|||** /| |/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|| ~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `-~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `-
*Jessie MNG Lopez Suzuki*
PhD Candidate, Molecular, Cell and Developmental Biology *Zahler Laboratory* The Center for Molecular Biology of RNA University of California, Santa Cruz Sinsheimer 419 (831) 459-5127 *jlopez99@ucsc.edu jlopez99@ucsc.edu* (they, she or he pronouns)
On Wed, Feb 16, 2022 at 2:00 PM Tom Goddard goddard@sonic.net wrote:
Hi Jessie,
ChimeraX VR works with all the PC VR headsets including the Oculus Quest 2 and the Valve Index. It uses SteamVR for the PC to talk to the headset and as long as SteamVR continues to support a headset it will keep working with ChimeraX. I have not heard anything about support for HTC Vive being dropped. That is an old headset and it has not been made for a few years now I think, but it still works fine. Could you tell me your source about support being discontinued? Maybe future SteamVR could require firmware updates to the headset and HTC will not produce those, and that could kill the headset. But I think that would make HTC Vive users very mad so I doubt HTC will kill their old Vive headset.
Here is advise for VR. I have used Quest 2 with a cable to the PC (Oculus Link), works perfectly. I've used the Quest 2 with their beta AirLink which connects to the PC by wifi with no cable, worked perfectly. My Quest 2 is the lower memory model (128 GB) because I don't put a lot of games on the headset so it cost only $300. I paid another $100 for a Kiwi headstrap that and face pad that is more comfortable, and for the link cable. This is very cheap and the best bargain.
I also have a Valve Index with their famous Index controllers and base stations, cost is $1000. There are some technical differences with the Quest 2 that may make you prefer it or may make you prefer Quest 2.
Both Quest 2 and Valve Index feel pretty horrible on my face -- which is surprising because I have many older headsets (Oculus Rift, Oculus Rift S, HTC Vive, HTC Vive Pro, Samsung Odyssey) that all feel pretty good. The Quest 2 is very heavy because it contains a battery since it is mostly intended to use standalone without a PC. (ChimeraX cannot run standalone on Quest 2 because it does not support the Android operating system). So comfort-wise I like most our Vive Pro headsets ($1200 or $1400 for Vive Pro 2) and use those most often.
Besides the headset the graphics card is an important and expensive item for using PC VR. Graphics cards are super expensive right now due to supply chain issues. A top of the line RTX 3090 has suggested price of $1500 but you might have to pay $3000 to get it. That is the top end. A $400 graphics card will work well for most data. But a 5 year old graphics card (e.g. GTX 1060) might struggle some with a new higher pixel resolution headset (e.g. Quest 2 or Valve Index or Vive Pro 2), while it might be fine for your lower resolution HTC Vive headset which is almost 7 years old now (released March 2015).
Tom
On Feb 16, 2022, at 11:32 AM, Jessie Lopez via ChimeraX-users < chimerax-users@cgl.ucsf.edu> wrote:
I am writing an article promoting the use of VR for modelling. I use an HTC Vive to access ChimeraX VR, but I have heard rumours it will be discontinued soon. The Samsung Odyssey is already discontinued. With Meta dominating the VR headset market, many companies are bailing out. Do you have any recommendations about which headsets should scientists invest in if they want to use ChimeraX?
Thank you!
-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. . ||**|||** /|||**|||** /|||**|||** /|||**|||** /|||**|||** /|||**|||** /| |/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|||/ **|||**|| ~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `-~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `-
*Jessie MNG Lopez Suzuki*
PhD Candidate, Molecular, Cell and Developmental Biology *Zahler Laboratory* The Center for Molecular Biology of RNA University of California, Santa Cruz Sinsheimer 419 (831) 459-5127 *jlopez99@ucsc.edu jlopez99@ucsc.edu* (they, she or he pronouns)
ChimeraX-users mailing list ChimeraX-users@cgl.ucsf.edu Manage subscription: https://www.rbvi.ucsf.edu/mailman/listinfo/chimerax-users
Hi Jessie,
Thanks for writing about how ChimeraX VR has been useful to you. I think the jury is still out on whether VR will be very useful for molecular structure. I still feel it has great possibilities. Here is a ChimeraX VR video I made just before the sars-cov-2 pandemic hit that I think shows some potential for the technology.
I cringe a bit watching it since I say "Wuhan coronavirus" a term that later became politically explosive, but this was made before the virus went global and it became political.
Another very cool possibility with VR is multiperson sessions and we do that often with ChimeraX. I am giving a live VR demo tomorrow at noon California time to the NIH Virtual and Augmented Reality Scientific Interest Group -- not sure if it is open to everyone.
Here is a ChimeraX VR use done at UCSF before the pandemic on leukemia drug resistance and a too slick video promoting it -- but these labs were using the VR every week before the pandemic hit.
https://pharmacy.ucsf.edu/news/2019/10/vr-drug-discovery-makes-precision-the...
And one last thing. The leader in molecular VR is Nanome, a commercial product made by a San Diego startup company. ChimeraX VR is kind of Gimp, to Nanome's Photoshop. Nanome has much more effort put into the software development, while ChimeraX is more experimental (with all features free). Nanome has a free version and you should definitely try it -- you probably already have.
Tom
On Feb 16, 2022, at 2:12 PM, Jessie Lopez jlopez99@ucsc.edu wrote:
Thank you so much Tom! This is excellent information and will help me write my article. Thank you for your prompt and thorough reply and for your continued work on ChimeraX and VR development. I think it's so important!
The major claim in the discussion section of my recently published paper (Suzuki et al., PLoSGenetics, 2022 https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pgen.1010028) is a direct result of me viewing a spliceosome structure in virtual reality on ChimeraX. Even the lab that obtained the structure didn't notice how well positioned KIN17 is to act as a regulator of splicing cycle progression.
Thank you.
Jessie
-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. . |||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /| |/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||| ~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `-~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `- Jessie MNG Lopez Suzuki
PhD Candidate, Molecular, Cell and Developmental Biology Zahler Laboratory The Center for Molecular Biology of RNA University of California, Santa Cruz Sinsheimer 419 (831) 459-5127 jlopez99@ucsc.edu mailto:jlopez99@ucsc.edu (they, she or he pronouns)
On Wed, Feb 16, 2022 at 2:00 PM Tom Goddard <goddard@sonic.net mailto:goddard@sonic.net> wrote: Hi Jessie,
ChimeraX VR works with all the PC VR headsets including the Oculus Quest 2 and the Valve Index. It uses SteamVR for the PC to talk to the headset and as long as SteamVR continues to support a headset it will keep working with ChimeraX. I have not heard anything about support for HTC Vive being dropped. That is an old headset and it has not been made for a few years now I think, but it still works fine. Could you tell me your source about support being discontinued? Maybe future SteamVR could require firmware updates to the headset and HTC will not produce those, and that could kill the headset. But I think that would make HTC Vive users very mad so I doubt HTC will kill their old Vive headset.
Here is advise for VR. I have used Quest 2 with a cable to the PC (Oculus Link), works perfectly. I've used the Quest 2 with their beta AirLink which connects to the PC by wifi with no cable, worked perfectly. My Quest 2 is the lower memory model (128 GB) because I don't put a lot of games on the headset so it cost only $300. I paid another $100 for a Kiwi headstrap that and face pad that is more comfortable, and for the link cable. This is very cheap and the best bargain.
I also have a Valve Index with their famous Index controllers and base stations, cost is $1000. There are some technical differences with the Quest 2 that may make you prefer it or may make you prefer Quest 2.
Both Quest 2 and Valve Index feel pretty horrible on my face -- which is surprising because I have many older headsets (Oculus Rift, Oculus Rift S, HTC Vive, HTC Vive Pro, Samsung Odyssey) that all feel pretty good. The Quest 2 is very heavy because it contains a battery since it is mostly intended to use standalone without a PC. (ChimeraX cannot run standalone on Quest 2 because it does not support the Android operating system). So comfort-wise I like most our Vive Pro headsets ($1200 or $1400 for Vive Pro 2) and use those most often.
Besides the headset the graphics card is an important and expensive item for using PC VR. Graphics cards are super expensive right now due to supply chain issues. A top of the line RTX 3090 has suggested price of $1500 but you might have to pay $3000 to get it. That is the top end. A $400 graphics card will work well for most data. But a 5 year old graphics card (e.g. GTX 1060) might struggle some with a new higher pixel resolution headset (e.g. Quest 2 or Valve Index or Vive Pro 2), while it might be fine for your lower resolution HTC Vive headset which is almost 7 years old now (released March 2015).
Tom
On Feb 16, 2022, at 11:32 AM, Jessie Lopez via ChimeraX-users <chimerax-users@cgl.ucsf.edu mailto:chimerax-users@cgl.ucsf.edu> wrote:
I am writing an article promoting the use of VR for modelling. I use an HTC Vive to access ChimeraX VR, but I have heard rumours it will be discontinued soon. The Samsung Odyssey is already discontinued. With Meta dominating the VR headset market, many companies are bailing out. Do you have any recommendations about which headsets should scientists invest in if they want to use ChimeraX?
Thank you!
-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. . |||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /| |/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||| ~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `-~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `- Jessie MNG Lopez Suzuki
PhD Candidate, Molecular, Cell and Developmental Biology Zahler Laboratory The Center for Molecular Biology of RNA University of California, Santa Cruz Sinsheimer 419 (831) 459-5127 jlopez99@ucsc.edu mailto:jlopez99@ucsc.edu (they, she or he pronouns)
ChimeraX-users mailing list ChimeraX-users@cgl.ucsf.edu mailto:ChimeraX-users@cgl.ucsf.edu Manage subscription: https://www.rbvi.ucsf.edu/mailman/listinfo/chimerax-users https://www.rbvi.ucsf.edu/mailman/listinfo/chimerax-users
Hi Jessie and Tom,
To add to Tom's comprehensive evaluation: we also have HTC Vive and Vive Pro in the lab as well as Pimax Vision 8kx. All of them require the HTC base stations. They all work perfectly with ChimeraX on PCs running Windows. Personally, I like the HP Reverb G2 best, which I have at home - because it is smaller, comfortable and lightweight, has inside-out tracking (no base stations aka lighthouses required, which make setup tedious and add bulk and weight when taking it on a trip). Plus, the HP G2 has excellent lenses and 2k x 2k resolution, resulting in a clearer image than even the Pimax 8kx. And the G2 comes with hand controllers included for about $600. But I heard that the Quest 2 was also very good and its even cheaper and has the wireless option, as Tom mentioned. It may be the most advanced headset. You have to create a Meta account for it though.
Matthias
From: ChimeraX-users On Behalf Of Tom Goddard via ChimeraX-users Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2022 7:01 AM To: Jessie Lopez jlopez99@ucsc.edu Cc: chimerax-users@cgl.ucsf.edu Subject: Re: [chimerax-users] VR Support
Hi Jessie,
ChimeraX VR works with all the PC VR headsets including the Oculus Quest 2 and the Valve Index. It uses SteamVR for the PC to talk to the headset and as long as SteamVR continues to support a headset it will keep working with ChimeraX. I have not heard anything about support for HTC Vive being dropped. That is an old headset and it has not been made for a few years now I think, but it still works fine. Could you tell me your source about support being discontinued? Maybe future SteamVR could require firmware updates to the headset and HTC will not produce those, and that could kill the headset. But I think that would make HTC Vive users very mad so I doubt HTC will kill their old Vive headset.
Here is advise for VR. I have used Quest 2 with a cable to the PC (Oculus Link), works perfectly. I've used the Quest 2 with their beta AirLink which connects to the PC by wifi with no cable, worked perfectly. My Quest 2 is the lower memory model (128 GB) because I don't put a lot of games on the headset so it cost only $300. I paid another $100 for a Kiwi headstrap that and face pad that is more comfortable, and for the link cable. This is very cheap and the best bargain.
I also have a Valve Index with their famous Index controllers and base stations, cost is $1000. There are some technical differences with the Quest 2 that may make you prefer it or may make you prefer Quest 2.
Both Quest 2 and Valve Index feel pretty horrible on my face -- which is surprising because I have many older headsets (Oculus Rift, Oculus Rift S, HTC Vive, HTC Vive Pro, Samsung Odyssey) that all feel pretty good. The Quest 2 is very heavy because it contains a battery since it is mostly intended to use standalone without a PC. (ChimeraX cannot run standalone on Quest 2 because it does not support the Android operating system). So comfort-wise I like most our Vive Pro headsets ($1200 or $1400 for Vive Pro 2) and use those most often.
Besides the headset the graphics card is an important and expensive item for using PC VR. Graphics cards are super expensive right now due to supply chain issues. A top of the line RTX 3090 has suggested price of $1500 but you might have to pay $3000 to get it. That is the top end. A $400 graphics card will work well for most data. But a 5 year old graphics card (e.g. GTX 1060) might struggle some with a new higher pixel resolution headset (e.g. Quest 2 or Valve Index or Vive Pro 2), while it might be fine for your lower resolution HTC Vive headset which is almost 7 years old now (released March 2015).
Tom
On Feb 16, 2022, at 11:32 AM, Jessie Lopez via ChimeraX-users <chimerax-users@cgl.ucsf.edumailto:chimerax-users@cgl.ucsf.edu> wrote:
I am writing an article promoting the use of VR for modelling. I use an HTC Vive to access ChimeraX VR, but I have heard rumours it will be discontinued soon. The Samsung Odyssey is already discontinued. With Meta dominating the VR headset market, many companies are bailing out. Do you have any recommendations about which headsets should scientists invest in if they want to use ChimeraX?
Thank you!
-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. . |||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /||||||\ /|
|/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||||/ ||||||/ |||||
~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `-~ `-~ `-` `-~ `-` `-~ `- Jessie MNG Lopez Suzuki
PhD Candidate, Molecular, Cell and Developmental Biology Zahler Laboratory The Center for Molecular Biology of RNA University of California, Santa Cruz Sinsheimer 419 (831) 459-5127
jlopez99@ucsc.edumailto:jlopez99@ucsc.edu (they, she or he pronouns)
_______________________________________________ ChimeraX-users mailing list ChimeraX-users@cgl.ucsf.edumailto:ChimeraX-users@cgl.ucsf.edu Manage subscription: https://www.rbvi.ucsf.edu/mailman/listinfo/chimerax-users
participants (3)
-
Jessie Lopez -
Matthias Wolf -
Tom Goddard